Sat
Mar 5 2011
04:03 pm
3000 Strong at Today's Teacher Ralley in Nashville
By: WhitesCreek

Our intrepid on the scene teacher reporter reports that the teacher rally brought in a large crowd in spite of the rain. A few Tea Partiers stood along part of the march route but weren't that noticeable otherwise. The Tea Party rally was held in a different spot so no idea how many they had.

Here's one sent to us...


Rep. Mike Turner, D-Nashville, warned that Republicans won't stop with dismantling teachers' unions and bargaining rights. "They'll be coming after police officers, firefighters, construction workers and service workers."

Story in the Tennessean

If you can read this, thank a teacher!

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 5, 2011 - 6:10pm.

Representative Mike Turner spoke and told the crowd that the Tea Partiers were unhappy with Haslam for not taking a strong stand against unions. This crowd was unhappy with Haslam for not taking a strong stand for teachers. The Tea Party has an 18% favorability rating nationally whereas over 60% of Americans support the teachers.

You can't frame the debate

Submitted by Roane-Voter on March 5, 2011 - 6:16pm.

You can't frame the debate as anti-teacher and really expect people to say that they ARE anti-teacher. For someone who likes to criticize anyone who tries to simplify debates into emotional responses you sure seem to be okay with it in this instance.

"Thousands of Teachers and hundreds of Tea Partiers"

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 5, 2011 - 6:22pm.

The debate is framed as anti teacher by Republicans. In fact it is anti worker. All Workers will lose in this if Republican puppet masters get their way.

(link...)

Your poll reflects those who

Submitted by harrimanite on March 6, 2011 - 9:43am.

Your poll reflects those who answered it. There is a silent majority (including teachers) with far different views than the vocal ones carrying all the signs and making all the noise.

There isn't any poll

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 6, 2011 - 10:39am.

There isn't any poll anywhere that supports destroying the rights of workers to collectively bargain with their employers for safe working conditions, fair pay, reasonable working hours, vacations and weekends. Public employee unions are no exception. The silent majority you speak of is more than just silent...It is nonexistent.

Of all these horrid republican bills there is none more obvious than the one that would let politicians take the right of teachers to choose their own pension fund oversight. this happened in Wisconsin and now they've lost over 2 billion dollars out of the fund they paid into. This is mponey teachers paid out of their pay checks. There is a simple answer to why Republicans want to take away teachers' right to guard that fund. Republicans can't wait to give their bosses on Wall street the keys to the vault.

silent majority

Submitted by onetahiti on March 6, 2011 - 2:28pm.

The "silent majority" in this house includes two former teachers. We aren't out carrying any signs, but only for reasons of poor health. We are 100% pro-union and would be out there "making noise" if we could.

-- OneTahiti

Well, there's five in this

Submitted by harrimanite on March 6, 2011 - 3:32pm.

Well, there's five in this household that can't see where collective bargaining has helped our education system one bit.
Has our education system vastly improved since the unions joined in... I don't think so. We are still consistently ranked lower than other countries.
Our system isn't being "fixed" or even "improved" because of collective bargaining.

H, I would be interested in a real study along those lines

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 6, 2011 - 3:40pm.

A real study did find this to be true:

All else equal, joining a union raises a woman's wage as much as a full-year of college, and a union raises the chances a woman has health insurance by more than earning a four-year college degree.

You make statements that cannot be backed up as if they are gospel...Oh, wait?

Manipulate the statements

Submitted by harrimanite on March 6, 2011 - 5:37pm.

Manipulate the statements any way you want but my question remains unanswered...
Just show me the proof that collective bargaining makes a difference in a child's education acheivements. Or that it has improved our education system.
You talk about cuts in funding but then the collective bargaining or unions didn't stop that either.
So how has it helped the job that's supposed to be done... giving our children a better education.

I realize this is anecdotal

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 6, 2011 - 7:53pm.

I realize this is anecdotal but the five states that do not have collective bargaining for teachers are at the bottom of the educational ladder. So is Tennessee. You are trying to make the case that eliminating unions for teachers will improve our educational system and there is absolutely no evidence that this is true and lots of evidence that this would be a disaster for our kids.

No, I am NOT trying to make

Submitted by harrimanite on March 6, 2011 - 9:19pm.

No, I am NOT trying to make a case that removing unions would improve the education of our children.
So quit making false assumptions.
My argument is that I don't see it making ANY difference, one way or the other. And so far, you've not shown any proof to contradict that.
And the schools you referred to could just as well been seated on the bottom with (or without) collective bargaining. Again, show proof.

H..That argument doesn't hold water

Submitted by randmart on March 6, 2011 - 3:53pm.

Voters constantly defeat school improvement measures and force continuous budget cuts. The best teachers in the world would find it impossible to effectively teach 30-40 students per class. Why do you suppose so many of our kids get left behind? Do your homework....those countries that are doing a better job run as low as 6-10 students per teacher. Now you would further reduce the quality of education by reducing teacher compensation. And make no mistake about it, that's what these bills are about.

Saw the Mrs in Tennessee

Submitted by bizgrrl on March 6, 2011 - 6:41am.

Saw the Mrs in Tennessee Guerilla Women's last linked video.

What a wonderful crowd. Many thanks to all public school teachers!

These are the people who teach your children. Treat them right.

..

Submitted by BTMatthews42 on March 7, 2011 - 1:05am.

SAT/ACT scores- the five non-unionized states ranking 44th in the country (Virginia), 47th (Texas), 48th (Georgia), 49th (North Carolina) and 50th (South Carolina),-Brian

Before anyone starts talking

Submitted by BTMatthews42 on March 7, 2011 - 1:08am.

Before anyone starts talking about Texas and the poll that the GOP love to throw around about the kids there being alright. The other part of the poll gets left out.. Texas- the kids are not all right. The high school graduation rate, at just 61.3 percent, puts Texas 43rd out of 50 in state rankings. Nationally, the state ranks fifth in child poverty; it leads in the percentage of children without health insurance. And only 78 percent of Texas children are in excellent or very good health, significantly below the national average -Brian

Remember the Texas Miracle?

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 7, 2011 - 6:46am.

Republicans used to point to Texas and show how test scores had improved under then Governor Bush's leadership. That turned out to be another Bush lie when it was discovered that the reported numbers were absolutely fictional and that Texas students had actually lost ground.

Incidentally, I just heard the most dishonest report from WUOT about the rally. The report started by saying their were thousands on BOTH sides in Nashville and then had a long statement by a tea partier, There weren't Thousands of Tea Partiers, there were maybe three hundred at best. We don't know because phtots of the Tea Party counter rally are conspicuously absent from the "liberal" media.

You listed a few "other"

Submitted by harrimanite on March 7, 2011 - 6:56am.

You listed a few "other" things that COULD contribute to lower scores. That's my point exactly...
Don't pin your education system ranking on one specific thing that actually benefits the teacher more so than anything that might trickle down to the student.

Stop and think about this, H

Submitted by WhitesCreek on March 7, 2011 - 8:25am.

You have t backwards.

There is no evidence that eliminating collective bargaining for teachers will make education better and that is what Republicans are claiming. It's a lie. What it will do is harm a group of people who typically oppose Republican policies. This is a political move and nothing more. Eliminating tenure means that administrators can fire "trouble makers" who challenge administrative policy regardless of their caliber. Eliminating collective bargaining means that state Republicans can continue to destroy public education as they have been doing since Ronald Reagan's time. Our schools will be the worse for it and our children will bear the burden for their entire lives.

We differ in what has caused

Submitted by harrimanite on March 7, 2011 - 11:50am.

We differ in what has caused our education decline. You blame the Republicans (as usual). I blame the decline in parental guidance and support from the home base.
It's a moral problem that starts in the home and government cannot legislate/force morals.
You blame the "Rs", I say that the "Great Society" and the entitlements involved with it,that Lyndon Johnson implemented was the start of the decline.

You can pour all the money into teachers and schools you want and still not overcome the decay of the American home.

When kids can't read, write or do basic math at a 5th grade level, but can program an Ipod or download apps faster than most can dial a number, or they walk around with earpads and deplorable music blasting in their ears all day and half the night, something needs to change.
And, as good as any teacher can be.. they will have trouble forcing a child to excel, regardless of their pay, benefits, or job security.

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